Display Keep Sources Sorted option for all styles

[stakats]

I don't have the option with multiple sources, either with a new citation or with editing an existing citation. If I recall correctly I used to be able to select the option only with a new citation but now I cannot access it at all. Using latest trunk and plugin 1.0b3

[simon]

Are you using the Python or VBA plug-in, and are you sure the style you're using specifies a sort order for citations? I'm not seeing this issue with either plug-in on my machine.

[tjowens]

I think the current situation is confusing.
If you use a style like APA that sets a sort order you have the ability to toggle sorting on and off. If you have a style like Chicago that does not you have no option. It would seem to make more sense to leave this option available all the time. If the style does not spesifcy a sort order just default to alphabetical.

[dstillman]

Why would we display an option that had no effect? That seems more confusing to me.

A better option might be to show it but disable it if it's not available...

[tjowens]

Sorry if I was unclear.

I am saying that irrelevant of the CSL you are using you should be able to use that toggle to alphabetize or unalphabetize your set of multiple sources.

[simon]

Frank, what are your thoughts on this? I'm not convinced this is worthwhile, but the changes would be almost entirely on your end, so you have the final say.

[fbennett]

I'd have to come out against, I'm afraid. Only a partial solution would be possible, and we'd end up spending extra time explaining its limitations.

Assuming that the ticket is about sorting in the style output, implementation would be a fairly hair-raising experience (since I'm very nearly completely bald, that might not be an entirely bad thing, mind). We can't sort on string output, because it's littered with markup. To sort on keys, we'd have to decide which ones to use, in which priority. A style that sorts citations on purpose will normally have some sort of fallback mechanism, that shadows what gets rendered in the cites -- if no author, then editor, if neither, then title, if not that, then anon ... and if authors are identical, use year as secondary key.

We would have to decide on the keys and their fallbacks, and the subkeys and their fallbacks, without reference to the style code. We would end up producing wrong output in some cases, and that would be pretty confusing (to me, at least) -- your first port of all would be the CSL file, which would reveal that the style isn't supposed to sort at all.

It wouldn't save much labor, as things stand now. A couple of clicks will be enough to get most citations into the desired order, against one click for a sortable box that's unselected by default -- and if sort order is not reflected in the UI (which I think I would prefer personally), you'd have to check the style output to find out if the shot-in-the-dark sorting algorithm produced a desired result. You'd probably end up spending more time getting things right rather than less.

I think that about covers it. :)

[fbennett]

(if it was not appropriate for me to close this, let me know)